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jus_MikeP
Avid Member
USA
161 Posts |
 Posted - 04/07/2009 : 12:00:43
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This is a subject that us as contractors face on a daily basis, but as a new contractor on block I'd sure love to know how some of the successful contractors out there are handling this...
I recently got a call to quote an additional cable line install. I drive 40 minutes to the lady's house, go into the attic to see if I have access to this room (it's a sunroom), move some furniture around to check the location on the wall that she wants it and I come up with a way to get the cable line there and I figured I can have the job completed in about 30-45 minutes. I go ahead and quote here my standard flat rate price for adding an additional cable line, which is $125. I have all the material on the truck to do the job (as I usually do) and tell her I can do it right then and have it completed within the hour. She calls and discusses it with her husband and the tells me that they want to get some other prices. What do you guys do in this situation? At this point I don't want to do the job for $125 - I'm surely not going to make money doing the job for that price by making a second trip (That's 2.5 hours of driving, and an hour of labor + materials). I don't know what do you guys do here?
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Mike |
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480sparky
Avid Member
218 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2009 : 12:57:54
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| Start charging for estimates. |
Do you realize that in 40 years, we'll have millions of old ladies running around with lower back tattoos and pierced navels?
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brsele
Active Member
Canada
85 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2009 : 15:20:56
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I'm also new, but I don't justify my rates to anybody.
One thing that I've already learned is that some customers are cheap and if you did the job for free, they'd still probably complain about you being too expensive.
If I would have been you, I would have explained that if I have to make a second trip back, that the price will not be $125. It will be more.
As for charging for estimates, in my area nobody charges for estimates, so being the new guy, I'm not going to buck the trend.
Bruce |
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aline
Avid Member
USA
192 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2009 : 15:22:57
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quote:
Originally posted by jus_MikeP
This is a subject that us as contractors face on a daily basis, but as a new contractor on block I'd sure love to know how some of the successful contractors out there are handling this...
I recently got a call to quote an additional cable line install. I drive 40 minutes to the lady's house, go into the attic to see if I have access to this room (it's a sunroom), move some furniture around to check the location on the wall that she wants it and I come up with a way to get the cable line there and I figured I can have the job completed in about 30-45 minutes. I go ahead and quote here my standard flat rate price for adding an additional cable line, which is $125. I have all the material on the truck to do the job (as I usually do) and tell her I can do it right then and have it completed within the hour. She calls and discusses it with her husband and the tells me that they want to get some other prices. What do you guys do in this situation? At this point I don't want to do the job for $125 - I'm surely not going to make money doing the job for that price by making a second trip (That's 2.5 hours of driving, and an hour of labor + materials). I don't know what do you guys do here?
Charge a dispatch fee to come out for a small job like this. If they have you do the work while you're there waive the dispatch fee.
If they want you to think it over and maybe have you come back later don't waive the disptach fee.
Another option is to present them with two prices. One price if they agree to have you do the work while your there and another price if you have to come back and do it later.
Explain that if you can do the work while there it will save you money so you can pass those savings onto them.
I also wouldn't tell them I could have it done within the hour. I might say something like I can have this completed for you today or maybe something like I can have this completed for you this afternoon.
If you really want to get serious about it you could check into something like Charlie Greer's Service Technician Survival School. He covers this among other things in his DVD's http://www.hvacprofitboosters.com/ |
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iplaypearldrums
Avid Member
USA
155 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2009 : 12:23:25
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& get a VISA #.  |
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jus_MikeP
Avid Member
USA
161 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 00:01:47
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| I appreciate all of the helpful advice! |
Mike |
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kapakahi
Avid Member
USA
251 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 02:22:45
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| Very good advice from everyone here. This is a common problem with facts changing all the time but the same resounding theme. If everyone in town is not charging for estimates then you have to recover it somehow. Todays times are harder and there are a lot of hungry guys out there. Besides, the customer is also hungry. It seems to me the best option is offer the price today and the price tomorrow. Up to them. If they want to shop around they may get someone cheaper or they may end up going with you anyway. I try to be honest and up front and sell myself and my quality. Once you have your foot in the door you are way ahead of the next guy. So, in this case, work on your sales pitch because you are the first guy in line to get the job. Good luck. |
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John A. Peters
Forum Magnate
USA
1852 Posts |
Posted - 01/24/2010 : 12:28:16
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Yes - times have changed. We now do free estimates. I used to charge $60 applicable to the work.
In your case, with the sun room, try guess-ta-mating two or three prices. Average price. Higher price if there is no access. Lower price if all goes well . . . whatever is appropriate. (Tea and cakes served to you) (smile)
The idea here is to save your time. Don't go in the attic, etc. Instead do or say some thing that will let them know that "you know your stuff." "I did a job like this recently and it cost $xxx but your job may be easier, should I take a look in the attic?
Since you may not be comfortable with a door charge, try telling them on the phone some thing like "I am going to come out there ready to do the job. If I give you a "good" price will you be ready to have me do the work right a way?
Practice the above on your wife or kids. Have it in mind or on a 3x5 card for the next time a customer calls in from more than a 15 minute drive.
Be sure to report back here and let us know what went wrong and there fore what you learned.
WHY CHOOSE TO PAY A LITTLE BIT MORE?
http://www.brooklineelectric.com/categories/why-choose-to-pay-just-a-little-bit-more.html
JP |
Same Day Service 415-239-5393 SF Electrician SF John A. Peters, San Francisco CA www.BrooklineElectric.com/ |
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RS377
Forum Magnate
USA
1009 Posts |
Posted - 01/24/2010 : 17:22:44
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quote:
Originally posted by brsele
I'm also new, but I don't justify my rates to anybody.
One thing that I've already learned is that some customers are cheap and if you did the job for free, they'd still probably complain about you being too expensive.
If I would have been you, I would have explained that if I have to make a second trip back, that the price will not be $125. It will be more.
As for charging for estimates, in my area nobody charges for estimates, so being the new guy, I'm not going to buck the trend.
Bruce
Personally I really like this one.
Maybe even add in that the price is x now and its x+ 1 hr. (or whatever your drive time is) later. Edit- the price is x, but if we do it today, price is x minus whatever.
I have an incredibly hard time with the idea of charging for estimates. Mostly, because I would never pay one. |
Taught well
----Full time contractor May 18th, 2007 |
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rewire
Member
45 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2010 : 13:50:36
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| the way I handle this is when they call me back and want the job done I tell them that their is an additional trip charge |
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RS377
Forum Magnate
USA
1009 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2010 : 01:02:05
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quote:
Originally posted by rewire
the way I handle this is when they call me back and want the job done I tell them that their is an additional trip charge
Do you tell them about this before hand? |
Taught well
----Full time contractor May 18th, 2007 |
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rewire
Member
45 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2010 : 11:06:59
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quote:
Originally posted by RS377
quote:
Originally posted by rewire
the way I handle this is when they call me back and want the job done I tell them that their is an additional trip charge
Do you tell them about this before hand?
No.If I have given a "do it now" price I will ask for an additional trip charge,they called back so they either want me or I was low bidder either way most will pay the extra. |
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RS377
Forum Magnate
USA
1009 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2010 : 12:29:55
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| So, they are aware that it is a "do it now" price? |
Taught well
----Full time contractor May 18th, 2007 |
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rewire
Member
45 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2010 : 19:50:30
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quote:
Originally posted by RS377
So, they are aware that it is a "do it now" price?
Yes . |
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John A. Peters
Forum Magnate
USA
1852 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2010 : 18:41:25
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In my specialty (power restoration) they usually do not ask. If they do, I say "I don't feel comfortable giving prices over the phone" and quickly change the subject." Or "My bids are free, I have to take a look first and I will give you a price, and if you don't agree, then I will leave"
After I look over the job and see it is an easy one, I show them my (PRE-PRINTED THAT IS WHAT COMPUTER PRINTERS ARE FOR) regular (Smile) price on an invoice and let them know "Since you asked about the price, I can give you a discount at the end of the job." Often they say "No, that is ok". So I say sign here.
On a bid for a larger job I need to get enough information to judge their need. Just listening to them say on the telephone "I want an estimate for some electrical work" is not good enough. Hay! this is 39 years of experience speaking.
If you are going to spend a bunch of time and gas going there and then going to spend more of your time and then use your knowledge and experience to do an estimate, you should almost (mentally to your self) do the bid on the phone unless it is really large. Ask them if there is a set of plans.
By the time you get through interviewing them you will have found out (from the tone of voice and their willingness to take their time to give you details etc.) how serious they are and how much competition there is.
Watch out for a owner who delegates the job of getting bids to an assistant. You can be sure there will be multiple bids, if not before you go, then after you go. All the Boss has to do is delegate to the assistant "Lets get a couple more"
You should be giving a "hand out" booklet with copes of your license and insurance plus some good stuff like this.
http://brooklineelectric.com/categories/why-choose-to-pay-just-a-little-bit-more.html
It is (C) copyrighted but yu can do something of your own in the same voice.
http://brooklineelectric.com/blogs/bathroom-lights-are-not-working.html
This is just a service call story.
JP
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Same Day Service 415-239-5393 SF Electrician SF John A. Peters, San Francisco CA www.BrooklineElectric.com/ |
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dmagyar
New Member
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2010 : 20:26:46
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I'm new to this forum, so Hello all.
I do agree with what John said regarding staying out of the attic for the estimate, extend that to anywhere the owner won't be following you. I've learned the hard way after several times crawling under a home to look at a different jobs and not ending up with the job. Limit your loss, as these are estimates add your travel time to the job into the estimate, then you could say by doing the job while you're there that you can credit them with a small amount. That may do the trick and you then don't have to charge more for a return trip if they want to price shop (you probably won't get the work anyway if thats what they're doing). Also with some, if you're charging what you should be making many will work for less, so don't be disappointed if they pass and you miss out.
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Dan Magyar
Magyar Electric, Inc.
Rocklin, Ca. |
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John A. Peters
Forum Magnate
USA
1852 Posts |
Posted - 03/03/2010 : 00:23:30
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How soon do you want the work done?
I can save my time & your money if you . . .
Shal I bring what I need to do the job today?
If you had the answers to the above, what would you do differently?
1) Go anyway?
2) Spend time you saved to
A) Get board?
B) Work on your marketing?
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Same Day Service 415-239-5393 SF Electrician SF John A. Peters, San Francisco CA www.BrooklineElectric.com/ |
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RS377
Forum Magnate
USA
1009 Posts |
Posted - 03/03/2010 : 01:54:00
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quote:
Originally posted by dmagyar
I'm new to this forum, so Hello all.
I do agree with what John said regarding staying out of the attic for the estimate, extend that to anywhere the owner won't be following you. I've learned the hard way after several times crawling under a home to look at a different jobs and not ending up with the job. Limit your loss, as these are estimates add your travel time to the job into the estimate, then you could say by doing the job while you're there that you can credit them with a small amount. That may do the trick and you then don't have to charge more for a return trip if they want to price shop (you probably won't get the work anyway if thats what they're doing). Also with some, if you're charging what you should be making many will work for less, so don't be disappointed if they pass and you miss out.
Wait, I thought the cornerstone of the flat rate service provider was that all costs are presented upfront and that's what made them superior to the mere mortals using T&M? |
Taught well
----Full time contractor May 18th, 2007 |
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Mshea
Avid Member
Canada
152 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2010 : 12:02:49
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We used to add the second trip when called for estimates and then offered a discount to do it now.
So in your case the estimate is for $200. but if you want to do it now I can discount the dispatch fee and save you $75.00. It is easier to estimate the cost of a second trip when quoting.
Now if it was for a job you could not do without a trip to the wholesale or big enough to require scheduling then just a simple it will cost $XXX including all lost time.
Small jobs are very hard to make money at. There is so much unaccounted time in small jobs. Sure if you have a big job close by and you have a hole in the day a small job can make money but $125 to install a cable might seem a lot for 1 hours work, except you took 2 1/2 hours with billing, driving, BS with the customer, etc. That and if you have to come back or it disrupts the work flow on another job. It can be impossible to get 200 out of a 100 dollar job and 100 is still better than 0. You certainly can get a lot more accomplished if the job takes the full day and every hour is productive.
Know how much it costs including profit and your wages to go to work. Take the work that allows you to meet that amount and charge more for the jobs that fall short. |
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Defending your rates...
