Electrical Forum - Homeowners tampering

Ek's Home | Forum | Chat | Electrical Links |

Subject - Homeowners tampering
Electricman	Hey all, Just asking for some imput. We just started some finish work on a small custom home and as soon as I got to the house I noticed someone had changed a single gang switch box to a 3 gang box. Upon further investigation I learned the homeowner didnt like the price of adding some ressesed lights in his great room and even after being warned by the homebuilder not to tamper he went right ahead and did it anyway. The problem is not only did he tamper with my wiring(how dare he)but he failed to understand what was happening with the circuit already installed. I had a dead end 3-way switch in a single gang box and he added 2 14-2s in there plus the 3 gang box. The 14-2s go up into the ceiling and are not terminated anywhere(future recessed I guess).So I told the homebuilder if this guy wants to play sparky tell him to buy a fish tape and fish in his own feed to his circuit and install his recess lights asap so I can finish and inspect. So my ? is any of you guys ever experience this and how did you handle it. I have been a licenced electrician for 6 yrs and people never stop to amaze me. Thanks for your imput.
Scott Vickrey	quote: how dare he This had me laughing Fortunately, I have never run into this before. I do know people that would do something like that. Did he think you wouldn't notice?
Electricman	I dont know if he thought I would. But I did so I guess hes in trouble with the builder. Hes msde a mistake cause this particular builder never seems to lose with an homeowner their probably gonna "get him" in the closin costs. Some seem only to learn the hard way.
JimmyDee	In Michigan, the home owner has the right to do his own electrical work but not under your permit. I would ask him nice if he would like you to fix it (for a price)or you could then explain to him that it is not going to work or pass inspection and you will explain to the inspector that you did not do the work. Let the chips fall where they may. Jim
David Hyatt	I would explain to the home owner you are responsible for his mess, make him pay you to do it right, or don't call for the inspection. If he wanted to wire the house himself he should of not hired you. I hate worse than anything to go behind another electrician to straigten out their mess, I sure don't want to go behind a homeowner.
cal_sparky	electricman, First, make sure that you've got the latest progress payment in the bank. Then, I'd have a joint discussion with the hoemowner and GC on the phone. Tell HO that you've noticed some wiring that you didn't install, that's not called for on the print or specs, that it's dangerous (loose wires in ceiling), and it won't pass inspection. And even if it would, it wouldn't function as intended. Don't provide any explanation beyond that (even if asked). Offer to install the extras at the price schedule you offered before. If they don't want to let you do the work, tell him/her that you'll have to remove the unsafe wiring, replace the three-gang box with the proper box, and it'll cost $xx dollars. If the HO doesn't want to listen to your expert opinion and let you do the work, let the inspector fail the job and make sure the inspector knows that the added stuff wasn't your work. This situation is not common, and I head it off at the pass by putting a paragraph in my contracts that the wiring is my sole responsibility, and intentional damage/tampering with/changes to the system by others will be repaired/removed, and there will be an additional charge at $xx/hr (plus any materials needed) to restore the system to proper configuration. This makes it less expensive for the HO to pay for the extra, than try to sneak it in themselves. If the HO doesn't like those terms, submit an invoice for the balance of the work done, and quit the job--on civil terms. You can make the point that you're responsible for the work, and your liability considerations/insurance will not allow you to have others (not under your control) working on the wiring. Best of luck, at least it seems that the general is on your side. Cliff
Electricman	Thanks Guys I know I could depend upon my bros in the trade for support. My employer says we are gonna get the underwriter to make a notation of our work and his (ahem) work. So thanks again for the info and input.
Jeremy	Seems to me, it would have been easier for the HO to just approach the electrician and ask about adding the lights. I don't know the complexities of the residential construction side, but in commercial (and theme park) installations I've designed lighting for, I get a lot better response asking the electrician for help. "Hey, I was thinking about a couple of extra lights over here...." Can this kind of thing be done informally between homeowner and EC? Or does GC need to be involved? Sure, there is a cost add, but it is still cheaper to do it before the drywall is in place.