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| Subject - best electrical panel | |
| wireman | I have seen and worked on a lot of different electrical systems and have heard a few things, pros and cons, on different panel brands. I would like to know what you guys think on the subject. What is the best, most reliable electrical panel on the market for residential? I just bought a 35 year old house ,wired with 2-wire no ground,I'm gutting it! and I want to rewire it with the best 200amp panel that I can get. Thanks for all replies >WM |
| bigvic | I use the Siemens with the copper bus. My supplier sells a 200 amp 40 circuit w/main for $74.99. Also when you purchase a panel you can get 1000' of 14-2 for $59.99. Never had a problem with Siemens since they changed their main breaker from the interlocked dual 100 amps. |
| JimmyDee | I feel that the Sq D panels are top line. Not the home line but the QO series. Haven't used a Cutler Hammer in some time but they are good also. Havent't used one because they don't make a piggy back and that has caused me some problems on what should have been small, low cost projects. However, they are top line. Jim |
| lctrc789 | I too like SQ D type QO breaker boxes. Thye seem to snap in tighter on the bus bar and give you a better connection to me. The Cutler -Hammer brand is a good one as well, I have used both. I think ITE is a good brand as well. Type QO SQ D comes with a piggy back breakers as well as ITE. You are right Cutler -Hammer doesn't have this. I think they are all good that they sell now the exception for me would be The cheaper brands that they used to sell like the general device type they had real problems. I would recommend you get a well known brand and one that you could have compatible breakers with. If you are gutting and re wiring then you should wire to new codes and install the panel you want, Why not go to a 40 space 200 amp panel and you can have all the room you need or want. |
| bigvic | Cutler Hammer does make a tandem (piggyback) plug-in breaker http://www.electricsupplyonline.com/prod/circuit_breakers-cutler_hammer.php |
| lctrc789 | Are you referring to the Cutler - Hammer type that is compatible to GE,SQ.D(homeline) or ITE.? Or the Brown colored Cuutler- Hammer tpe. I have seen the compatible type in Piggy backs but never the brown colored type. |
| JimmyDee | They sure look like the old stand by CH breakers. Jim |
| bigvic | They are CHT2020......Not the Cutler Hammer BR style Cutler Hammer bought out Bryant so that is there new residential series |
| lctrc789 | OK so it is the newer homeline brand they have on the market, gotcha. 15 years ago or so the company I worked for had a residential side and they installed nothing but Cutler-Hammer (brown colored) type breaker boxes. The wholesaler and Cutler - Hammer was giving a conditional Lifetime warranty on these breakers, it was very unique for a while but it soon subsided out. I know that they did not sell a piggy breaker at that time and I have never seen one in that type. Appreciate you clearing that up. |
| NORCAL | The last decent loadcenter is the CH "Classic",no plastic,[unlike SQ D] copper buss, limited use of twin breakers,I hate twins and avoid the use of them whenever possible,and if the panel won't accept them all the better. If you look at a C-H catalog you will see only a limited amount of the CH Classic panels will accept CHT twins. |
| David Hyatt | Well, no one has mentioned GE yet. So I thought I would chime in. I always when installing a new panel use GE. I don't know why except that is what my teacher used. Never really thought one to be better than another, haven't really put much thought in the matter. But I have never had a problem with GE. If I had one complaint is that GE descent seem to have the working space that other panels have. also the supplier I use is a GE Representative so it is more convenient for me. On rewires where I install the panel outside, GE has a meter/ main combination panel that really speeds up the service installation process. |
| iwire | How about this, there is no 'best electric panel' Each has good and bad points, I hate GE ground bars, I like GE breakers. I like Square D panel covers and breakers but the space is tight in many of these panels. In my opinion any of the major brands are serviceable and should last a long time if installed correctly. I consider Square D the top of the line but even they have problems they are recalling thousands of Arc Fault breakers. quote: |
| cs409 | Iwire gets the A for best response,,,,no best panel,,,i agree 100percent... all have plus/minus good/bad points.....it all comes down to what you are happy with, what the customer wants and what is in your area as supplies go.....best to all. |
| lctrc789 | That is why I mentioned I think they are all good. Use a brand that is compatible to others for ease of use. At one time Furrows sold a brand called general device or something like that. Even though they sold a lot of these, They were trouble very low RMS and they wouldn't trip in a lot of areas here we had replaced thousand of these. You are right they are all UL listed but to each his own I guess. |
| wireman | Thanks for all your responses. My posts seem to always open up good discussions! Perhaps there is no "best electrical panel" but certainly some are better than others. I think the optimum panel would be one that is widely used with a reliable track record, and easy to find breakers for, simply. I'm going with a Cutler Hammer. on another note, I had a feeling that when AFI's came out that I should take a wait and see aproach to them. Kind of like how I feel about first year production automobiles. I'll wait till they get the bugs worked out, then I'll try them in my house.>WM |
| sparkie2170 | I am very fond of the old Wadsworth breakers and panels. Great loose fit, plenty of airspace for arcs, and the wonderful buzzing and rattling sounds the breakers make. The good old Federal Pacific stablock thins are nice too, lots of wire bending space, and easy to remove breakers! (maybe thats why they call them breakers |
| JimmyDee | quote: I sure hope you are trying to be funny.  Jim |
| wireman | smells like sarcasm to me Jim. what do you expect from guy who actually calls himself SPARKY! |
| Mike Delaney | I like SQD HOMELINE. We install it in all of our houses. It's cost effective, easy to use, and can be found anywhere. I like QO but it is about double the price, and you have to buy the cover seperate. I had a home owner one time that wanted me to install a CH brown style panel in his home. He was talking them up, copper bus, this and that. So I started to install the panel, first by knocking out the little screw holes on the side, with my lineman pliers and screw driver. I droped my linemans, and it broke three plastic pieces that the breaker snap into...copper bus, but cheap plastic pieces. Needless to say I wasn't impressed. I don't like GE because of the skinny style breakers and the fat size breakers, it is confusing when installing a 2 pole skinny, making sure its on both phases, and the breakers seem cheaply made. I like Siemens because the ground bar is already installed, and the screws are backed out. |
| nino | I like General Electric ,here in Puerto Rico is a basic panel used in residential,also in vocational school and institutes of electricity. |
| wireman | I am reconsidering using SQ-D QO they are very slick.And I will be installing AFI's since I have furher educated myself on them. It is code now. I am considering instaling AFI's on my garage circuits also. Would anyone reccomend using them on any other circuits in the house.Seems to me that one would only be partially protected by installing AFI's only in the bedroom. Also I would think that it would be a good Idea for kitchen appliance circuits since there are many different appliances on them, sharp utencils and cords etc. |
| fgw | First post for me. I really enjoy reading all the different opinions and such. Much thanks to whomever created this website. Now, in reference to "what's a good panel", If Sparky likes FPE I'm sure he'll go head over heels for a Zinsco set up. I've changed out many of them here in the older towns in Florida. I've yet to find one without burn marks, breakers fused to the bus, disintegrated breaker cases, etc. I do save the old breakers in case I cross paths with someone that needs one. My personal favorite has always been Square D. In all the years I've been a practicing professional, Square D seems to be the panel with the least amount problems. Sq.D is also the most common around here (East coast, central Florida). Maybe that's all that was available years ago? Regardless, I believe all (or most) brands have their good points, as well as, their bad points. Except, of course, Zinsco... Funny how they only had bad points. And quite a few of them. |
| aussiesparky | quote: H'mmm interesting "WM"!! so what do you get when you add "aussie"? 
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| aussiesparky | BTW DU Clipsal would have around 60-70% of the market for domestic and light commercial breakers and boards. Always seem to have heaps of room. |
| JimmyDee | quote: I guess you would get an "Andrew". ???  Jim |
| wireman | well i guess my point would be that if sparks are flying you're doing something wrong! Anyway no offense. I just knew of this guy once who called himself sparky and he wasn't an electrician, although he told everyone that he was. He could wire stuff up and it would work, but it wasn't anywhere near code. one of those guys you would have to go behind and fix everything he did. It's when I was doing my appreticeship in Hawaii. the running joke between the J-man and the crew when you found anything that was not wired properly was that Sparky did it! |
| sparkie2170 | It must be a Chicago thing, there is always "light hearted" joking between the trades. They call us sparkys, and we refer to plumbers as turdies, turd chasers. Carpenters as wood butchers, bungalow busters. There are tin knockers, brickys, tolly heads, (painters) etc. |
| wireman | I know they call us sparkys. I guess I have to get over it. It's not just a chicago thing, it's everywhere. Plumbers have it the worst! Also here If the carpenter is lousy (nothing level or plumb) we call him a "HACK". Landscapers are "Dirt Pushers" .The supervisor is the "Stupidvisor". General manager becomes the "general moron". OK LOL |
| journeyman491us | ...I would agree with the other posts...there really is no "best". I have always been partial to BRyant, yeah I know Cutler Hammer bought out Westinghouse/Bryant. When refering to Cutler Hammer you gotta be specific now "CH" or "CH-BR". GE is good, Siemens is good too...but recently had a problem with the neutral bar, can't remember exactly what the problem was though. But as the manufacturers' keep getting cheaper and cheaper electricians will continue to curse. Remember the good old days when Bryant (and even murray) had neutral bars that had multiple large screw terminals?? MAYBE Some "real old timers" could weigh in on this question? Why in "the old days" with "stacked neutral bars" (the old FPE, Murray, and even some commercial lines) Why did they always grab the first row, leaving the only un-used screws buried under five pounds of spaghetti??? You know the ones I'm talking about?? You go to tie into the panel and feel more like a "microscopic surgeon", praying to god the thing doesn't blow up on you??? ...Personally if I have a choice I will AVOID CUTLER HAMMER because of how cheaply made they are getting. Has anyone seen the new design change Cutler Hammer has in it's 20 Circuit 100 Amp Panel??? The left hand "neutral bar" is connected to the right side bar with two straps and an 8-32 screw!!!! How much cheaper can they get??? Is it just me or anyone else from the old school that Grounding components are only suppose to carry fault current and are to be "mechanically sound"??? Here is my bet: In 5-10 years C-H is going to be dealing with a flurry of lawsuits when these panels start having problems!! ....But hey...Maybe someday the manufacturers will start asking electricians opinions' on how to make their products better...instead of making more headaches for us!!! ...If they are listening  BIGGER NEUTRAL BARS WITH MORE SCREWS!(C-H).........PROTECT YOUR TRADE...BOYCOTT C-H!!!! |