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| Subject - failed my inspection | |
| shocky |
I failed an inspection today, the inspector said I failed because I did not identify the disconnect with which panel that fed the disconnect I installed for a rooftop a/c unit.I identified the load side on the disconnnect for which unit it served, even though it was evident.But where in the code does it say I have to identify the line side of the disconnect on the disconnect? The breaker for the disconnect is on the first floor of a one story school. The disconnect is non-fusible and labled as a service disconnect only.Should I go to battle over this, or is there something I'm missing?
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| JimmyDee | I think I would just purchase a paint pin and give him what he wants. Print it on the cover with a paint pin. Jim |
| shocky | there are 28 units that were installed months ago in 5 acre building. i can't possibly remember where all the breakers are. unless i look inside the disconnect where i wrote them.inspector didn't even open it! |
| shocky | units are spaced about 15 feet apart, it is evident which disconnect goes to which unit.the unit #is labeled just not the feeder circuit. |
| Ryan_J | 408.4 could not be satisfied unless you can distinguish one disconnect from the one next to it. Could this be the case? |
| shocky | just remembered that.thanks |
| Ryan_J | If you need to work on the disconnect, and you go to the panel, can you readily determine which breaker suchs off which disconnect? |
| cs409 | that inspector has way to much time on his/her hands...they are either being very nic picking or they are testing u! have u had inspections with this inspector before and if so, how did it go? |
| Pierre Belarge | Article 408 is for panelboards and switchboards. Scope. This article covers the following: (1) All switchboards, panelboards, and distribution boards installed for the control of light and power circuits (2) Battery-charging panels supplied from light or power circuits. the reference for the described disconnect is: 110.22. Each disconnecting means shall be legibly marked to indicate its purpose unless located and arranged so the purpose is evident. As long as there are no specifications on the prints, I would ask the inspector to cite the code reference he is refering to. The reference that Ryan has mentioned is required back at the panel or distribution board the disconnect conductors originate from. Pierre |
| iwire | quote: I understand all areas are different but I have not yet seen anything that gives an inspector any authority to enforce job specifications. If the job does not match the specifications what article can an inspector cite to fail or hold up the job? Here in the New England states I work in, MA, RI, CT, NH the inspectors enforce the NEC they do not enforce job specifications. IMHO the job specifications are none of their business the inspectors seem to feel the same way. 
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| lctrc789 | You have to remember that the NEC states that all local jurisdictions have the final say. They can supersede the NEC or have their own codes and bylaws. I have found never to peev off a local inspector, unless you totally disagree or think it is very unsafe. If you don't do as they ask they can make it very hard on you on future jobs and talk about NIT PICK LOL I have dealt with many. One local utility company here has the local jurisdiction say so, they NEVER allow you to run a water ground at all.Another requires you to ground at their meter base, you can argue all day and say where does the NEC state this and they will tell you we have the right and jurisdiction to go over and beyond the NEC |
| Pierre Belarge | Bob You should know me better than that... but just to let you better understand what I meant about the specification issue. I do not believe the inspector can inspect job specifications, what I meant is the EC needs to be aware that job specifications may exceed the code requirements. Actually when there are more restrictive job specs, it usually makes an inspector's job easier  I still stay that if the inspector is not correct and is asking for what 'he likes' that understanding the code (local or not) not only helps you, but everyone after you. If in fact the inspector tries to get tougher after that, then I would go over his head every time (as long as you are right) until he gets the picture. I cannot stand an inspector who does this, and I will tell you that I myself in the past have had to deal with it. My father taught me to always stick to my guns if I thought I was correct...needless to say, I do  Pierre |
| iwire | quote: Without a doubt that is correct, but whatever they decide to change must be adopted in writing by the AHJ. An AHJ can not make rule up at the spur of the moment. |
| iwire | quote: I got you now. |
| Pierre Belarge | Bob You mentioned that an AHJ cannot make rules up at the spur of the moment, well as we all have experienced, they do  , but they shouldn't.Again, the only way to fight fire is with fire. Hit them where it hurts...in the NEC!!! 
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| JimmyDee | In a recent past news letter we get from the State of Michigan, construction inspection department, it was clarified that any failed portion of the job has to be communicated to the electrician in writing and a code article # has to be given. The article went on to say that if this is not done, there is no violation. Period. I say, its about time. Its hard to do a job correctly if the rules change as the wind direction changes. Jim |
| iwire | I have one now that wants me to relocate a 75 KVA transformer and a panel that has a lot of raceways entering it. He has cited 110.26 and he is correct, the installation does not comply with 2002 110.26. However it did comply at the time it was installed. I am remodeling the space, it is very likely I will not even open the panel cover of the panel above the transformer or of the panel that needs moving. I am reconnecting to the circuits where they had been cut off by the demo crew. I do not think he is within his authority to make me do anything about this. Did I say so? Heck no, if I have to move this stuff it is an extra, I gave the info to the buildings management and they can either fight the inspector or pay us to make the changes. Bob |
| lctrc789 | You are right they cannot make things up as they go, you can fight that, but I was a local inspector for a time and I always went by the NEC. However we also have addendums to the codes we have always told everyone to call first or to come on in. The local utility comapny here gives you a few pages of things they like for services etc. We too have sheets for addendums to the NEC and our county codes. Many of the guys know to call and ask some do not, I don't have anyone that gets upset because we always have everything documented. The largest of the power companies here have a Gold book you must abide by for the services you install. I think this inspector is nit picking but you can always just identify the disconnect and be done with it. |
| shocky | just got back from the electical board meeting. my inspection passed, and the inspector got an ear full from the cheif inspector,maybe lost his job.i think i'll apply for it!!! |
| JimmyDee | Glad to hear you won that battle. It sounds like they had an incompetent hard butt that needed to be straightened out. Jim |
| ravengotu | I can only speak from experience..but as a good pratice to label all electrical componets I.E. breakers ,panel numbers....and if you ever work service you will be glad that it was done..have a good day but dont argue over the call...just get a sharpie and label...he will be happy as you and we live to fight another day. |