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	Subject - aluminum branch circuit wiring. blackrd I recently did a panel upgrade in a condo with aluminum wiring in all the branch circuits. I should have refused the job, because of the aluminum branchs. I had a hard time finding out much about it. This is what I found out, and I dont vouch for the info 100%. Came onto the market around 1966 in response to a copper shortage. The first problems(besides fire) was that the insulation wasnt robust enough for the heat generated by al's higher resistance, The second problem was alu receptacles and switches werent available/invented, and so we used what was available, switches rated for copper. About 1970, the insulation issue was resolved, and the new approved devices also came onto the market. This contributed to a lessening of the fire hazards associated withsaid wire. Aluminum premise wire disappeared altogether by about 1976. How is the best way to deal with alu branch circuit wiring. An article I read by an insurance institute recommends nothing less than a complete gut and rewire. Remember this if you pull ajob with alu in it. In doing this job the homeowner wanted al the receps and switches replaced(ivory to white). Which was a good idea, considering circa 1973 construction, most of the receps and switches were original. This predated gfi receps, which had been placed into service by another party at some point. What I found on these receps, and some other switches, was ppigtailing onto the aluminum with copper conductors. wirenutting together with a dielectric grease of some sort. What I was able to find out about splicing alu to copper,(per the insurance article) was that the only approved method for joining these two was a pressure connection using a sleeve and crimp style method. When I called the larger supply houses to explain what I had and what I needed, I hear the guy in the background saying to someone else "I dont know what this guy is talking about,why dont you talk to him". My understanding of the history of aluminum has been that the splicing and terminations have caused the most problems. I think anybody should refuse a alu job if it is anything short of a gut job. It seems to historically been more problematic than K/T. Any thought on this subject would be greatly appreciated. JimmyDee I had a regular job, repairing devices and burnt off wires, at an apartment complex wired with Al romex. It finely got rewired (we didn't get the job). I agree with your assessment that the only way I would get involved again is to do a complete rewire. I know some have had success with the pig-tailing but the Al house wiring just did not work out. Wirenutz so where does the mighty AFCI fit into this scenario? one would assume by the way Sq D, CutHam and others carried on about thier magic widget that it would have been a cure for any sort of bad connection becoming a hazard ? ~W~ mahlere blackrd, actually these days Ideal makes a UL listed wirenut for pigtailing. No need to use the crimps any more. If done correctly - Penetrox and pigtailing, aluminum wiring is no more dangerous than any other wiring method. The problem comes with unqualified and unsafe installs. Putting AL directly to CU only devices (see this alot), pigtailing with standard wirenuts (no penetrox at all) things like this. The biggest problem with AL (as far as I know) is the rapid and extreme expansion and contraction. This causes the device terminals to loosen over time, resistance, heat, fire. Not a fan of aluminum wiring, but when done correctly, not as bad as it get blamed for. lctrc789 They do make an approved wirenut for al- cu for pigtails, I have used for years a standard wirenut with NO-ALOX always with the pigtail jobs I have done till some one came out with better ideas, crimping is one way with still a no alox. When aluminum was used in the 60 s and 70 s theyhad no idea of what problems it would cause, thereore these days we learn to replace it or repair it. In the early to late 1980s I worked for a company that specialized in nothing but old residential work and we became specialist in re wiring, older homes, through schooling and the industry we grew well and had many insurance comapnies, VA and HUD who recognized us for what we did.... To tell a homeowner that they have to re wire a home is very shocking to them as well as very expensive, but we did our share of them as well as repair what we could, by pigtailing and no aloxing what we had, we had very few problems and still have very few to this day.. With proper maintenance and being cautious they work with insurance companies and they do OK a repaired job if done properly.. I am sure they would like to have them all re wired as well as I would, think of the money to be made / but for many homeowners this is a cost they simply cannot afford on top of a mortgae and kids etc... I do not like it and have dealt with it for years and have learned to be tactful with what I say. IT is dangerous, if not maintained properly or repaired properly by qualified people. Arc fault detectors may be one way of less fires and deaths caused by this type of installation. Ryan_J According to the CPSC, the only way you can do it is by going to a special certification program and using their crimper. The NEC would permit the purple wire nuts, because they are listed for the purpose (110.14). An attorney that is worth his/her salt would dig up the info from the CPSC, however. blackrd That was the only approved method that I was able to find, using the crimper. Finding the crimper and sleeves was the problem. The pigtails I discoverd did use the ideal grease,and i was forced to repigtail with the grease too. I really would have been happy doing the panel, I just dont like the liability associated with this stuff, even if it was just replacing switches and receptacles. If something happens, who gets the blame? LK Quote: "An attorney that is worth his/her salt would dig up the info from the CPSC, however." ___________________________________________________________________ Yes they would, not the chance you want to take, many of these homes have been purchased by new owners, and the purchase price of these homes, were reduced in many cases, however the new owners just considered that found money, and never replaced the wiring. As for the 65 nut, it is considered as a temp connection, not permenant repair, the only accepted method is the crimp or rewire. We hear all the time "what am i to do tell them they have to rewire or have expensive crimping done" Yes tell them, we have had complete families wiped out in our area, from jobs where copper and alum were mixed, they could have been prevented. Let them know the dangers involved, they may not understand. blackrd I believe the article I read about the crimp method said something like $60-80 per opening to correct, but peace of mind is priceless, especially when your the EC. LK blackrd, It would be best to recommend a contractor, that has the training and tools to do the job, a contractor just did a job, in the next town from me, he charged $9400 to do all the connections. blackrd It appears alot of guys dont know of the crimp method. $9400 for the job? was this a house? Sounds lucrative but limited. Scott Vickrey Another thing that I really hate about aluminum wire is that aluminum is not maliable. Bend the stuff one to many times and it comes apart. stedder Yea I agree with scott, you have to be real careful when stripping the insulation, it's a good idea to make sure the customer understands the hazards so that whenever an oppertunity arises the wiring can be replaced (if they can't afford a gut) but being made aware of the dangers is usually a big enough bug in the ear and you get a call back before long. Wirenutz just got done with an alum house gut job, add the diy effect to it, and boy o boy, did i ever find some bad splices ! ~W~ blackrd Betcha made some dinero on that one! cvelectric I have done a couple small repairs on al. branch circuits (burned up recepts. due to the loose connections). I pigtailed a piece of cu., using the Ideal purple wire nuts, to the new recepts. I made sure to write on the invoice that I recommend replacing all the al. wiring. Don't know if this really covers my exposure to liability though? If I had to add anything (like a recept. etc.) I would insist on pulling a new circuit.